JOKER: FOLIE À DEUX

jrockbridge

jrockbridge

Stealing Your Riffs
My wife and I watched it knowing it got mostly bad reviews. We got through the entire thing. I, mostly, enjoyed the singing. I thought Phoenix and Gaga did the best they could with bad material.

I agree with these review snippets….

“A tedious legal drama bolstered by dull musical numbers that lacks the audacity of its predecessor.”~Rene Sanchez

“Joaquin Phoenix and Lady Gaga give incredible performances as the Joker and Lee, but the overall story feels more like an Epilogue and not a standalone film.”~Lauren Veneziana

“The desire to break with the established order seems to me to be a bad joke made by awful people who hate the Joker.”~Yasser Medina
 
I enjoyed the first one but skipped this one at the theater. I might stream it next week while everyone but me is out of town.
 
jp_nyc said:
I enjoyed the first one but skipped this one at the theater. I might stream it next week while everyone but me is out of town.
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I feel bad for Phoenix and Gaga. They did what they could. I wish the writers and director had found a way to make it less slow and dark.
 
I just watched the People's Joker, an unauthorized, ultra-DIY trans coming out story built into the Joker story. It was really great. I like Lady Gaga, so I might see the official Joker movie if I see the disc at the library.
 
jrockbridge said:
My wife and I watched it knowing it got mostly bad reviews. We got through the entire thing. I, mostly, enjoyed the singing. I thought Phoenix and Gaga did the best they could with bad material.

I agree with these review snippets….

“A tedious legal drama bolstered by dull musical numbers that lacks the audacity of its predecessor.”~Rene Sanchez

“Joaquin Phoenix and Lady Gaga give incredible performances as the Joker and Lee, but the overall story feels more like an Epilogue and not a standalone film.”~Lauren Veneziana

“The desire to break with the established order seems to me to be a bad joke made by awful people who hate the Joker.”~Yasser Medina
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Joker: Drop A Deux more like it.

Speaking of Gotham City, the wife and I really enjoyed your suggestion of The Penguin. It's like a Gotham City Sopranos, only much better. We have one episode left. We will check it out today.
 
jelloman said:
Don't feel bad for Phoenix...the whole concept for the movie came from a dream he had...
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No kidding? He can be brilliant as an actor. Yet, he seems to be a bit crazy.

In the group dynamic of a full production, you would hope there is, at least, one adult that’s willing to stand up and let everyone know when things are going off the rails. Isn’t that the job of a director? Seems like everyone in this thing smelled each others farts and told each other how great everything was going. Oh well.
 
jrockbridge said:
No kidding? He can be brilliant as an actor. Yet, he seems to be a bit crazy.

In the group dynamic of a full production, you would hope there is, at least, one adult that’s willing to stand up and let everyone know when things are going off the rails. Isn’t that the job of a director? Seems like everyone in this thing smelled each others farts and told each other how great everything was going. Oh well.
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The director HATED that the original Joker movie was a hit with the "comic book" crowd...he quite seriously felt it attracted the WRONG audience and was not interested in EVER making a sequel... Folie A Duh exists because the studio forced it on the director and gave him full creative autonomy...the movie was intentionally a direct assault on the "incels" that liked the first one...it was intended to fail...
 
jelloman said:
The director HATED that the original Joker movie was a hit with the "comic book" crowd...he quite seriously felt it attracted the WRONG audience and was not interested in EVER making a sequel... Folie A Duh exists because the studio forced it on the director and gave him full creative autonomy...the movie was intentionally a direct assault on the "incels" that liked the first one...it was intended to fail...
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Mission accomplished. :ack:
 
I finally watched this and really enjoyed it. I actually think it's better than the first one. I totally get that the director hated the popular reaction to the first one and used this as a giant fuck you to the incels who think The Joker is a hero.

I liked that they moved away from the the obvious Taxi Driver/King of Comedy rip off of the first movie. It's about the consequences of his actions. There is no heroic rebel. Just a loser with nothing more to lose. And it ends badly. The heroes journey is complete.

I also distinctly remember complaints about the 'old fashioned music from the 30s' and actually thought it would be the cast miming over old 45s or something. One of the things that put me of watching it until now. But no, a modern audience just can't handle 'singing' and 'instruments'. I think they were expecting Wicked.
 
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I followed this up by finally getting around to The Penguin. Really enjoyed it. Colin Farrell's performance is unbelievable. Someone described it as The Sopranos in Gotham. I completely agree, even lifts some of the plot points. And Farrell basically apes James Gandolfini, but he pulls it off.
 
jelloman said:
The director HATED that the original Joker movie was a hit with the "comic book" crowd...he quite seriously felt it attracted the WRONG audience and was not interested in EVER making a sequel... Folie A Duh exists because the studio forced it on the director and gave him full creative autonomy...the movie was intentionally a direct assault on the "incels" that liked the first one...it was intended to fail...
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This knowledge as well as my feelings towards most musicals is why I've never watched this film.

Thank you for reinforcing this for me. :helper:
 
I thought the first one was a edgelordy cringefest that was as deep as a puddle but pretended it was the mariana trench, and that combined with a musical sounds pretty close to personal hell to me.
 
pmc100 said:
I finally watched this and really enjoyed it. I actually think it's better than the first one. I totally get that the director hated the popular reaction to the first one and used this as a giant fuck you to the incels who think The Joker is a hero.

I liked that they moved away from the the obvious Taxi Driver/King of Comedy rip off of the first movie. It's about the consequences of his actions. There is no heroic rebel. Just a loser with nothing more to lose. And it ends badly. The heroes journey is complete.

I also distinctly remember complaints about the 'old fashioned music from the 30s' and actually thought it would be the cast miming over old 45s or something. One of the things that put me of watching it until now. But no, a modern audience just can't handle 'singing' and 'instruments'. I think they were expecting Wicked.
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Wicked was great, so those are some pretty big ruby slippers to fill.
 
Motorik said:
Wicked was great, so those are some pretty big ruby slippers to fill.
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I'm not dissin' Wicked :grin: But it's a different kind of movie for the musical crowd and a musical for the non-musical crowd. Neither crowd could handle it.

I actually only saw Wicked a few weeks ago and have never seen the stage version. It was alright :shrug: It was no Moulin Rouge!
 
Motorik said:
Wicked was great, so those are some pretty big ruby slippers to fill.
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I assumed it wouldn't be good. Now I will watch it.

On another note. My buddy from middle-school's grandmother came in 3rd auditioning for the role of Dorothy in the original Wizard Of Oz. Had she gotten Judy Garland's part, we probably wouldn't be talking about this right now. Or Wicked. Much of the world as we know it today might have turned out differently.
 
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I like musical theater. Not everything. The good stuff. Of the classics, Seven Brides For Seven Brothers, Singing In The Rain, and Oklahoma are some favorites.

I liked the first Wicked Movie. I assume I’ll like the second one. But, I think it was a greedy money grab to stretch it out to two movies. I’ll suck it up, rewatch part 1 and watch part 2 the next day at some point. Yet, it’s fair to say, it’s too fucking long!
 
jrockbridge said:
I like musical theater. Not everything. The good stuff. Of the classics, Seven Brides For Seven Brothers, Singing In The Rain, and Oklahoma are some favorites.

I liked the first Wicked Movie. I assume I’ll like the second one. But, I think it was a greedy money grab to stretch it out to two movies. I’ll suck it up, rewatch part 1 and watch part 2 the next day at some point. Yet, it’s fair to say, it’s too fucking long!
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I'm sure their motivations were not pure of heart, but it didn't phase me at all that they stretched it into two movies. They added some fun set pieces and some fan service moments. Compared to, say, the Hobbit movies, you can hardly notice the stretching and, if you love the source material, you might even be grateful for the extra time you can spend in that world.

As for the Joker sequel, it was a pretty wild thing to happen in a big-money picture and had some enjoyable moments.
 
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